Crimson Red Sports

Clay-Chalkville High School is the No. 1 (6A) team in the state. Last week it was determined that they have played an ineligible player all year and they were required to forfeit 9 games. The forfeits mean the highest ranked team in the state will miss the playoffs.

According to reports an un-named player transfered from Huffman High School. He was ruled ineligible to play at Huffman due to a disciplinary problem. AHSAA rules require that a transfer can not play for a new school if he left the old school in bad standing. It is the schools responsibility to verify that any transfer left their previous school in good standing and made a bona fide residence move to the new school zone. The AHSAA ruled the player ineligible. The school filed an appeal on Friday and the appeal was unanimously denied.

If the injunction is granted it will have ripples throughout the 6A state playoffs. My local high school will be one of the teams affected. We were the # 3 seed in Region 7. When CCHS had to forfeit games we moved up to the #2 seed. We are presently preparing to play a home game Friday night against Vestavia Hills. If the injunction is granted and the AHSAA ruling overturned we will play an away game against Hoover.

My question is this. Does the legal system have the power to overturn a ruling made by the AHSAA? This is a membership similar to the NCAA that has rules. They are rules not laws. The AHSAA ruled and heard the appeal. I think the matter is over. Can a NCAA member go to court to over rule an NCAA decision?

http://www.wrcbtv.com/story/15912304/team-goes-to-court-in-attempt-to-stop-sanctions

http://www.montgomeryadvertiser.com/article/20111027/SPORTS0301/110270325/Prep-football-No-1-Clay-Chalkville-forfeits-wins-out-6Aplayoffs?odyssey=mod%7Cnewswell%7Ctext%7CFrontpage%7Cs

I don't see any way that will happen. They will be denied. The courts have no jurisdiction, the way I see it.

I hate this whole situation, but I think this statement pretty much says it all:


Someone at the school dropped the ball on this.  I really hate it for the seniors, but I think the AHSAA made the correct decision based on the rules.  The other day I said that I hoped they would file an injunction.  In light of the quote above it is clear that someone at the school is responsible for this mess and they should accept the AHSAA ruling.  Now they are impacting all of the other schools who truly didn't have anything to do with this.

I suppose that student and his family will be moving again pretty soon before the whole town tries to lynch them.

According to this report CCHS is saying that Huffman withheld information that the player was expelled. CCHS is also accusing Huffman of being the school to turn them in.  :dunno:

http://www.cbs42.com/sports/story/Clay-Chalkville-appeal-denied-fight-continues/XfeeEeCaAUi9w-x519Mq2w.cspx

Well if that is true, I reverse everything I just said 2 posts up.

It is a question of who is telling the truth. You have to assume the AHSAA looked into this matter and determined Huffman is not at fault. I feel bad for the CCHS kids. They have a very good team this year.

In any case, the kids at Clay-Chalkville are being cheated by something that some adults did or failed to do.  What a sad situation.

Sorry, but we can't delay the playoffs because of some kind of problem between Huffman and Clay. The AHSAA was their chance to hear their appeal and story and they said no. I really don't think a judge in Alabama will touch this, this ain't California. Did the player lie to Clay about why he left Huffman, if so there's your problem.

 :popcorn2:

I don't see what it would hurt to delay for 1 week.  As it stands right now, the teams who are in aren't 100% sure who they should even be getting ready to play.  The AHSAA better be absolutely certain that new information isn't going to come out in the next couple of days that would change the outcome.  I don't know how much information they have, but they had better be sure they got it right.  If there are any doubts, delay for a week so they can have some time to do an investigation.

If Clay has any sort of new evidence that they followed the correct procedure to clear the player, then the judge may grant the injunction.  This is exactly what injunctions are for.

Everyone knows who they are playing based on Friday's ruling. All playoff team coaches and principals had a meeting Saturday morning in Montgomery to discuss the playoff paring and distribute playoff tickets to home teams.

If CCHS had any new information Friday's appeal meeting would have been the time to bring that information forward. I don't see anyway a judge would grant an injunction to delay the playoffs.

I'm thinking someone at Clay dropped the ball on this with the majority of AHSSA voting against Clay as they did. It's just so hard for me to think that the HC at Clay didn't check this kid out himself to prevent anything like this happening. It is possible that Huffman didn't forward all of the kids info as they should have, it's very competitive in the high school world anymore as these coaches try to recruit all the time. Anybody remember Propst at Hoover?

pmull you should have turned Hoover into the AHSAA for sometime and had them kicked out of the playoffs as well.   ;D


The kicker for Vesatvia ( Spina?) kicked a 50 yard FG Friday night but had the wind to his back.

I guess it would have to be something new they found since the appeal for them to have a chance.  If the AHSAA has no doubts about what happened when they made the ruling then I guess that is the end of it.  I have no idea what information they have, it may be obvious to them what happened.  But the whole incident smells like a setup to me.

This opens a HUGE door for similar lawsuits. Where do we draw the line once the door is open? A school suing based on a bad call by the ref, players suing because they aren't starting, coach's suing every time a player is deteremined ineligble? It opens a giant can of worms.

If they dropped the ball and didn't check him out like they were supposed to, then they have no case and the judge will deny the request (I hope).  I feel horrible for the boys who busted their tail all year, but the school is responsible in this case and there isn't anything that can be done about it.

If they were tricked and are innocent in the matter, as has been suggested, then they absolutely should get an injunction.  I have no idea if that is what happened or not, but if it is then this is exactly the right time to get the courts involved.  This isn't the same as a blown call.

I suppose that if Huffman simply did not send the papers, then Clay is still at fault.  They should not have played him until they got the paper work (see Duron Carter).  But if Huffman or someone gave them false information (intentionally or accidentally), then they should go to court.  I doubt this is the case though or it would have come out during the appeal.

This is a horrible situation and NOBODY wins here.  It is obvious how Clay loses, but the eventual state champion loses too because there will always be doubts as to whether they deserved it or could have beaten Clay.  Winning the championship is great, but if the best team in the state was eliminated due to rules trickeration (if that is indeed what happened), is it really a legitimate championship?

:think:  :popcorn2:

I would love to know what actually happened. Huffman is a bottom feeder that had no chance of making the playoffs. They were 1-9 on the field and 0-7 in the region. I can't help but think CCHS is not clean in this. They have been accused of recruiting players in the past. I would not be surprised if it was Hewitt-Trussville who turned them in. HTHS and CCHS hate each other.

(http://img1.uploadscreenshot.com/images/main/10/29820584441.png)

Sorry. Just thought this thread could use a horse.

It is so transparent when they do that. A kid moves to live with his uncles best friend or Dad moves across town to make it an extra hour to get to work.

I have not understood all this from the front end. If these guys are recruiting, what is wrong with getting players to come to school and play for them. It's been going on since I was in High School. I look forward to hearing what the courts have to say. RTR!

Plus the guy is NOT an orange eater, which he is according to his old Huffman coach.  I would love to know if this part is true.

What in the world does orange eater have to do with it SC? I ain't figured that out yet. Please alert me to what I am missing. RTR!

I talked with a friend today that shed a little light on this issue for me. He told me the kid was expelled from Huffman and enrolled at another school and I forget the name of it. He came to Clay from the other school with a clean record but Huffman still had the goods on him for when he was there. I think he said there is a time frame, maybe a year, that the kid has a chance to clean his act up for his previous suspension or being expelled. I'm not sure the needed amount of time had passed for the kid to be clean.

What wasn't clear to me was when he came to Clay with the clean record did anyone bother to check behind him for any complications with elgibility. The part that botherss me most is why the Coach at Huffman didn't notify Clay of the kids previous problem at Huffman and why did they wait until the 10th game of the season to notify the AHSAA. Personally I think Huffman is guilty of a wrong doing as well by not notifying Clay of the kids background, especially the coach at Huffman.

I'm sure I haven't gotten all of this accurate but it's within the ballpark of what happened. Maybe somebody else can follow this up and find out a little more info.

The ineligible player was expelled from Huffman. He enrolled in Restoration Academy which to my understanding is a school for troubled kids in Fairfield. Restoration is not an AHSAA shool. AHSAA rules state that if a player leaves a member school in bad standing he can not play for another AHSAA member school. IMO any kid transfering in from Restoration Academy should be thoroughly checked out and CCHS did not do that.

Huffman does not appear to be clean here either. The Huffman coach was quoted last week as saying Huffman did not turn CCHS in. It was reported this afternoon that Huffman was the school to turn them in. My guess is the player is not an orange eater.

CCHS has filed the motion against AHSAA according to WBRC.

http://www.myfoxal.com/story/15917589/cchs-files-motion-against-ahsaa

With the kid lying when asked of his elgibility means a lot in this case. Seems like Bama had an instance like that once that got them put on probation, Antonio Langham. I think there should be some seriuos consideration when it is proven that the lying caused the problem for the school. I also believe that these schools that purposely get other schools in trouble should suffer the same consequence as the school they turned in. Another idea would be that the AHSSA would send out a list to all high school coaches of the players that have been declared inelgible from the whole state at the beginning of school each year.

The AHSAA has been known for this kinda garbage for years.

Just look at all the schools that have are (3-7) or (4-6) in the playoffs. All the AHSAA had to do years ago was add a rule saying a team must have an overall record of .500 to get in playoffs. If there were not any schools that met this requirement then just don't represent that region.

I'm not sure a 5-5 record should get teams in playoffs.

Class 1A A.L. Johnson (4-5) at Pickens County (9-1), Reform Loachapoka (4-6) at Brantley (8-1) Keith (8-2) at Sweet Water (7-3) Kinston (3-7) at Winterboro (9-1) Notasulga (5-5) at Geneva County (5-5), Hartford McIntosh (5-5) at Maplesville (10-0) Pleasant Home (7-3) at Saint Jude (9-1), Montgomery Catholic HS Field Autaugaville (4-6) at Linden (9-1), Marengo HS, Dixons Mill Berry (9-1) at Addison (9-1) Gaylesville (3-7) at Ragland (10-0) Hackleburg (7-3) at Lynn (8-2) Appalachian (6-4) at Collinsville (9-1) Gaston (7-3) at Donoho (9-1), Anniston Hubbertville (7-3) at Shoals Christian (7-3), Florence Akron (6-4) at Cedar Bluff (5-5) R.A. Hubbard (7-3) at Marion County (9-1), Guin Class 2A Southern Choctaw (8-2) at Vincent (8-2) Houston Academy (5-4) at Elba (10-0) Billingsley (7-3) at Flomaton (9-1) Goshen (6-4) at G.W. Long (9-1), Skipperville Barbour County (7-3) at Zion Chapel (8-2), Jack Mobile Christian (5-5) at American Christian (9-1), Tuscaloosa Highland Home (7-3) at Providence Christian (7-3), Dothan Isabella (6-4) at Leroy (6-4) Woodland (6-4) at Colbert Heights (8-2) Sumiton Christian (6-4) at Fyffe (10-0) Lexington (5-5) at Reeltown (7-3) Sand Rock (6-4) at Tanner (10-0) Fultondale (8-2) at North Sand Mountain (9-1), Higdon LaFayette (7-3) at Red Bay (9-1) Ider (7-3) at Oakman (7-3) Lamar County (6-4) at Lineville (7-3) Class 3A Washington County (8-2) at Aliceville (5-5) Walter Wellborn (7-3) at Opp (6-4) Greensboro (5-5) at T.R. Miller (8-2), Brewton Slocomb (8-2) at Handley (10-0), Roanoke Leeds (8-2) at Abbeville (8-2) Trinity Presbyterian (6-4) at Gordo (7-3) Luverne (7-3) at Clay County (9-1), Ashland Montevallo (4-5) at Bayside Academy (10-0), Daphne Cordova (6-4) at Sheffield (8-2), Tuscumbia Geraldine (5-5) at Piedmont (10-0) Rogers (8-2) at Hamilton (8-2) Saks (6-3) at Sardis (9-1) Sylvania (8-2) at Glencoe (8-2) Holly Pond (5-5) at Lauderdale County (9-1), Rogersville Weaver (7-3) at Madison Academy (8-2), Madison Elkmont (6-4) at Hanceville (10-0) Class 4A UMS-Wright (6-4) at Greene County (7-3), Eutaw Elmore County (6-4) at Andalusia (10-0) West Blocton (7-3) at Thomasville (9-1) Straughn (6-4) at Dadeville (10-0) Lincoln (6-4) at Saint James (8-2), Montgomery Saraland (6-4) at Bibb County (10-0), Centreville Headland (6-4) at Beauregard (9-1) Sumter Central (4-6) at Jackson (10-0) Dora (8-2) at Brooks (8-2), Killen Cherokee County (5-5) at Anniston (6-4) Central-Florence (7-3) at Fayette County (7-3), Fayette Cleburne County (5-5) at North Jackson (10-0), Stevenson Fairview (7-3) at Alexandria (7-3) Corner (6-4) at Deshler (9-1), Tuscumbia Oneonta (8-2) at Guntersville (8-2) West Limestone (5-5) at Midfield (6-4) Class 5A Spanish Fort (7-3) at Fairfield (9-1) Brookwood (4-6) at Valley (8-2) McAdory (6-4) at Vigor (8-2), Prichard Tallassee (4-6) at Greenville (10-0) Paul Bryant (6-4) at Eufaula (9-1) LeFlore (3-7) at Hueytown (10-0) Charles Henderson (5-5) at Demopolis (6-4) Woodlawn (7-3) at Saint Paul's (9-1), Mobile Pinson Valley (8-2) at East Limestone (7-3) Boaz (5-5) at Hartselle (10-0) Russellville (5-5) at Center Point (9-1) Curry (5-5) at Etowah (9-1) Albertville (7-3) at Cullman (7-3) Chelsea (7-3) at Muscle Shoals (9-1) Walker (6-4) at Fort Payne (9-1) Athens (4-6) at Briarwood Christian (9-1) Class 6A Murphy (6-4) at Carver-Montgomery (7-3) Dothan (6-4) at McGill-Toolen (9-1), Lipscomb Complex, Mobile Benjamin Russell (6-4) at Davidson (7-3), at Baker HS, Mobile Foley (7-3) at Central-Phenix City (8-2) Opelika (7-2) at Daphne (9-1) Alma Bryant (3-7) at Prattville (7-2) Fairhope (8-2) at Auburn (8-1) Jeff Davis (6-4) at Blount (9-1), Eight Mile Minor (7-3) at Huntsville (7-3), Milton Frank Stadium Gadsden City (6-4) at Mountain Brook (10-0) Hazel Green (7-3) at Northridge (9-1), Tuscaloosa Spain Park (5-5) at Oxford (9-1) Hewitt-Trussville (8-2) at Hoover (9-1) Tuscaloosa County (5-5) at Bob Jones (9-1), Madison Vestavia Hills (6-4) at Austin (7-3), Shorty Ogle Stadium, Decatur Decatur (5-5) at Hillcrest-Tuscaloosa (10-0)

The way the playoffs are set up so 50% of the teams make the playoffs. It is hard for all teams to have a winning record when one half of the field is included. I like this playoff format. Eight teams in your region and the top four make the playoffs.

It is a story hscoach told us.  An orange eater is a player that doesn't really contribute anything to the team, but he comes in the locker room at half time and eats all the oranges they put out for snacks.

CCHS has filed a motion to overturn the AHSAA ruling forcing them to forfeit 9 games. The AHSAA has also filed a motion to dismiss the CCHS motion.

From everything I read both CCHS and Huffman need to get their act together. Huffman should have notified the AHSAA long before they did. Huffman claims they did not know he was playing for CCHS until they saw him on the field in the 9th game of the season.

The kid was expelled from Huffman for having 7 bags of marijuana on the Huffman campus. That was third quarter last school year. He was expelled for 12 months. He enrolled at Restoration Academy to finish the school year. He transfered to CCHS this year. The school reviewed the records from Restoration Academy which included Huffman transcripts but did not include any information regarding his being expelled while at Huffman.

The kid is not eligible to play this year at any AHSAA school. CCHS claims they checked his last school and his record was clear. The AHSAA says CCHS is required to check the last AHSAA school the kid attended to make sure his record is clear. The kid has been dismissed from the CCHS team even if they are allowed to play. The kid lied to CCHS about his past.

This could go either way. I'm back to my original question. Does a judge has jurisdiction to overturn an AHSAA ruling? 

The link below is the most recent information I could find. It is an AL.com article.

http://highschoolsports.al.com/news/article/-2231573373783629267/clay-chalkville-files-motion-to-let-cougars-play/

The judge has jurisdiction over the potential lawsuit that could follow, and injunctions are to limit damages in that potential lawsuit before it is too late.  I don't think CCHS has a case though, if they are indeed responsible for checking with the last AHSAA school.

I saw something that indicated that the judge would hear both sides today and rule on the injunction.  If he approves the injunction, that only means he is delaying the playoffs so that they have more time to figure out what is the right course of action.  It doesn't necessarily mean that he will ultimately side with CCHS.  If he denies the injunction then he is siding with AHSAA and it is over.

I think the issue of whether or not he was an orange eater has been settled now, with coaches from both schools saying that he really didn't contribute to the teams success this year:

After reading that article, I think CCHS does have a case, and a pretty good one at that:


The opposing school (Huffman) did not turn them in until after they lost to CCHS.  The coach didn't turn them in either, it was the new principal at Huffman who wasn't even the principal when the student was expelled last year.

Posting the roster like that is to prevent exactly this situation.  A team has an ineligible player, but nobody says anything until after the game, and only if they lose.  The reason they don't say anything before the game is because he would be removed from the team.  They want him to play though, so if they lose they can get the game forfeited.  Because of the rule about posting the roster before the game I think CCHS has a pretty good case here actually.  They should not have to forfeit any games where they posted the roster beforehand and did not receive any objections, especially when people at Huffman new he was ineligible and didn't say anything until after they lost.

CCHS makes a good case for themselves. I read the court papers earlier today and they may win. The AHSAA response is even though a roster is published it is not the other schools responsibility to do background checks on your players. It is the schools responsibility to check the record from the last AHSAA school to make sure the players record is clear.

I read where the lady judge said she would make a ruling no later than Friday. This could really screw up the playoffs for 6A teams. They will have to delay 1st round games. Our team is preparing to play Vestavia at home. That preparation will not do us much good if we end up playing Hoover instead.

Reads to me that based on the letter of the "law," that CCHS is guilty.  However, the circumstances are not cut in dry, and I think it should also be considered that the kid wasn't a star athlete so obviously CCHS had nothing to gain.  That alone proves that there was no intent.  It'd be a shame to punish the rest of the team after such a fantastic season.

I could see it going either way though.

Seems as though high school football can be as dirty as college football.

If I were the coach of one of these teams I would plan on playing whoever is scheduled for this Friday.  If anything happens that changes the schedule, I would expect the new game to be delayed until the next Friday.  That would be the only fair thing for them to do, although that doesn't necessarily mean it will happen.  But as the coach you really don't have a whole lot of options other than to get ready for the team you are scheduled to play right now.

I can see it going either way too.  I've flip-flopped half a dozen times in this thread.

I believe the judge will deny the motion. As a member of the AHSAA CCHS agrees to operate within the rules and regulations (by-laws) of the AHSAA. The AHSAA make a ruling based on their understanding of their own by-laws. If CCHS does not agree with the ruling the by-laws allow for an appeal. CCHS asked for and receive an appeal. The appeal was denied. The by-laws do not offer any other options. The AHSAA decision is the final authority.

Fox 6 news just reported that the Judge has ruled there must be a hearing on the injunction, did not say when it will be.