** ASK THE COACH **

[Chechem]

I started to put this question under hscoach's "Game Notes" thread, but didn't think it fit there.  Maybe we can use this thread for miscellaneous questions.

QUESTION:
I was watching a replay of the Aub-A&M game.  The Aub runner lunged for the pylon, but his left foot stepped out at the 2 1/2.  The ball was placed at the 1 1/2.  The announcers agreed, saying: "The ball was at the 1 1/2 when he stepped out."

This whole sideline 'where the foot touches' versus goalline 'where the ball crosses' crap is confusing.  The refs mark a runner out where his foot touches, but count the ball at the goalline.  WTH?  Were they correct in marking the ball at the 1 1/2 yard line??

I'd have put it at the 2 1/2.  After all, he's an Aub!!

In a related issue, this weekend I saw an NFL player extend the ball forward as he stepped OB short of the first-down marker.  He was granted a first down.  So, which it is, the ball or the foot on the sideline??

[hscoach]

That is one of the oddities of the game.  The officials "determine" where the ball was when a player goes down for the purpose of marking.

[N.AL-Tider]

That is one of the oddities of the game.  The officials "determine" where the ball was when a player goes down for the purpose of marking.

This ^  From my understanding, when a ball carrier steps out of bounds the officials make their best guess as to where the ball actually was at that point and mark it accordingly...  I personally feel they should change some rules regarding the out of bounds and endzone to be the same.  As it stands, a player can run the entire length of the field while holding the ball across the sideline as long as his foot doesn't touch out of bounds and the play is still active...

[Chechem]

That is one of the oddities of the game.  The officials "determine" where the ball was when a player goes down for the purpose of marking.

This ^  From my understanding, when a ball carrier steps out of bounds the officials make their best guess as to where the ball actually was at that point and mark it accordingly...  I personally feel they should change some rules regarding the out of bounds and endzone to be the same.  As it stands, a player can run the entire length of the field while holding the ball across the sideline as long as his foot doesn't touch out of bounds and the play is still active...

Exactly. It's inconsistent, subjective, and poorly officiated.  The NCAA needs to fix the rules on that.

 

[Catch Prothro]

That is one of the oddities of the game.  The officials "determine" where the ball was when a player goes down for the purpose of marking.

This ^  From my understanding, when a ball carrier steps out of bounds the officials make their best guess as to where the ball actually was at that point and mark it accordingly...  I personally feel they should change some rules regarding the out of bounds and endzone to be the same.  As it stands, a player can run the entire length of the field while holding the ball across the sideline as long as his foot doesn't touch out of bounds and the play is still active...

Exactly. It's inconsistent, subjective, and poorly officiated.  The NCAA needs to fix the rules on that.

 

Ya'll don't expect the refs to do a good job watching the ball carrier's feet and the football as he runs along the sidelines, do you?   

[2Stater]

That is one of the oddities of the game.  The officials "determine" where the ball was when a player goes down for the purpose of marking.

This ^  From my understanding, when a ball carrier steps out of bounds the officials make their best guess as to where the ball actually was at that point and mark it accordingly...  I personally feel they should change some rules regarding the out of bounds and endzone to be the same.  As it stands, a player can run the entire length of the field while holding the ball across the sideline as long as his foot doesn't touch out of bounds and the play is still active...

Exactly. It's inconsistent, subjective, and poorly officiated.  The NCAA needs to fix the rules on that.

 

Ya'll don't expect the refs to do a good job watching the ball carrier's feet and the football as he runs along the sidelines, do you?   

 

They've already made the refs stop chewing gum and officiating at the same time.

[Catch Prothro]

Hey, shouldn't Peewee get the first question?   

[Chechem]

Hey, shouldn't Peewee get the first question?   

Wish he were here!

[2Stater]

Hey, shouldn't Peewee get the first question?   

Wish he were here!

Me too. 

[Marshal Dillon]

That is one of the oddities of the game.  The officials "determine" where the ball was when a player goes down for the purpose of marking.

This ^  From my understanding, when a ball carrier steps out of bounds the officials make their best guess as to where the ball actually was at that point and mark it accordingly...  I personally feel they should change some rules regarding the out of bounds and endzone to be the same.  As it stands, a player can run the entire length of the field while holding the ball across the sideline as long as his foot doesn't touch out of bounds and the play is still active...

Exactly. It's inconsistent, subjective, and poorly officiated.  The NCAA needs to fix the rules on that.

 

Ya'll don't expect the refs to do a good job watching the ball carrier's feet and the football as he runs along the sidelines, do you?   

Yes! They have 2 eyes, one to watch their feet & the other to watch the ball.

[Catch Prothro]

The existing sideline rules bother me not in the least.  It is an entirely different matter than forward progress.  It is in-bounds v. out-of-bounds.  It is sideline-to-sideline, not downfield.  By the other way of thinking, that the ball hanging over the sidelines should be out of bounds, then when a player goes out of bounds, the ball should be spotted on the sideline for the next hike, instead of the hash mark.  But that isn't the rule, they measure forward, not lateral, progress.  Therefore, the sidelines rules are not logically inconsistent with forward progress or goal line rules. 

[Marshal Dillon]

The existing sideline rules bother me not in the least.  It is an entirely different matter than forward progress.  It is in-bounds v. out-of-bounds.  It is sideline-to-sideline, not downfield.  By the other way of thinking, that the ball hanging over the sidelines should be out of bounds, then when a player goes out of bounds, the ball should be spotted on the sideline for the next hike, instead of the hash mark.  But that isn't the rule, they measure forward, not lateral, progress.  Therefore, the sidelines rules are not logically inconsistent with forward progress or goal line rules. 

 

[Chechem]

The existing sideline rules bother me not in the least.  It is an entirely different matter than forward progress.  It is in-bounds v. out-of-bounds.  It is sideline-to-sideline, not downfield.  By the other way of thinking, that the ball hanging over the sidelines should be out of bounds, then when a player goes out of bounds, the ball should be spotted on the sideline for the next hike, instead of the hash mark.  But that isn't the rule, they measure forward, not lateral, progress.  Therefore, the sidelines rules are not logically inconsistent with forward progress or goal line rules.  

But the refs are inconsistent.  Watch when a player steps OB near the goalline.  Most of the time the ref marks the ball where the foot touches the sidelines, not where the ball was.  That's why I mentioned the Aub game as an example.  The ball was marked a yard ahead of where he stepped OB.

I can't find the NCAA rule about this, but I'll bet CP is correct, and the refs got it right in the Aub-A&M game.  But usually that's not the case.

 

[Catch Prothro]

The existing sideline rules bother me not in the least.  It is an entirely different matter than forward progress.  It is in-bounds v. out-of-bounds.  It is sideline-to-sideline, not downfield.  By the other way of thinking, that the ball hanging over the sidelines should be out of bounds, then when a player goes out of bounds, the ball should be spotted on the sideline for the next hike, instead of the hash mark.  But that isn't the rule, they measure forward, not lateral, progress.  Therefore, the sidelines rules are not logically inconsistent with forward progress or goal line rules.  

But the refs are inconsistent.  Watch when a player steps OB near the goalline.  Most of the time the ref marks the ball where the foot touches the sidelines, not where the ball was.  That's why I mentioned the Aub game as an example.  The ball was marked a yard ahead of where he stepped OB.

I can't find the NCAA rule about this, but I'll bet CP is correct, and the refs got it right in the Aub-A&M game.  But usually that's not the case.

 

There's probably some unwritten, unofficial rule, if you don't see the football use the foot.   

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